Comments on: How to Make Coffee with a Stovetop Moka Pot http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html Talk About Coffee is a must visit site for all the coffee lovers out there :)) Sat, 13 Mar 2010 15:09:13 +0000 hourly 1 By: Shantel http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-4242 Shantel Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:08:11 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-4242 Cast Aluminum is a relatively porous material; that is why a soap residue can build up on your aluminum pot if you wash it with soap, and also why a pot can be seasoned (so to speak) by brewing coffee in it. The same principle effects the kind of chinese clay pot that is only used to brew one kind of tea. I came back to this great thread to write about the Alessi 9090 I have had for just over a week now. Like Lucie, above, I was curious about it and could find very little info. The hardest thing to do here will be to avoid talking about the aesthetics--or I will get carried away and lose credibility, so I'll save that to the end. Is this pot worth the money (cost in the U.S. is equivalent to five or so Bialetti moka pots); does it offer any advantages, or what defines this pot's value? I personally bought the pot partly out of curiosity, spurred on by the demise of my Bialetti pot. Distracted, I had put it on the stove without water. My first clue to this blunder was when the handle fell off (clunk) on the stove. Inside, the rubber ring was fused to the top. That can't happen to the 9090. At worst, the ring could be melted off the steel. The handle is metal, so you won't get a half-melted handle, either (as on my first Bialetti pot). In short, I expect the 9090 to last long enough to recover the expense. About that rubber ring someone asked about: its purpose is to make a seal. Once you have a seal, compressing the rubber more won't make a difference if the pressure doesn't increase. Rubber performs very well in compression. For these reasons, I don't think the clamp mechanism means replacing the rubber ring more often. (It might be harder to find an Alessi ring though.) In use, this pot is a dream. The coffee holder stands up, so if you sleepily grind your coffee then need to put the holder down while you fill the base, you can. (At least on the tiny 1-cup model, which I have.) The pot snaps shut, and it makes quiet noises on the stove top; "ssssss" (boiling), a spitting sound while the coffee comes out, and "ssssss" when no more water will come up. A cap on the spout means you can leave the top flipped open without spatter on the stovetop. I dutifully used an inverted spoon on my Bialetti (on advice I found here) but I love not having to. I plan to wash this pot with soap (unlike my aluminum pot which I just wiped) in order to switch between coffees. There are cheaper stainless steel pots, but I don't like their looks much. That brings me to aesthetics: The workmanship on the 9090 is stunning; you can see the turned edges of metal at the top, simply but elegantly done, and the traces of welding, etc. It looks like a machine, and in fact I will end by saying that what it really reminds me of is a musical instrument. Not just because it is nicely made of shiny metal but because what it feels like to use it is like you're playing a little coffee tune. Cast Aluminum is a relatively porous material; that is why a soap residue can build up on your aluminum pot if you wash it with soap, and also why a pot can be seasoned (so to speak) by brewing coffee in it. The same principle effects the kind of chinese clay pot that is only used to brew one kind of tea.

I came back to this great thread to write about the Alessi 9090 I have had for just over a week now. Like Lucie, above, I was curious about it and could find very little info. The hardest thing to do here will be to avoid talking about the aesthetics–or I will get carried away and lose credibility, so I’ll save that to the end.

Is this pot worth the money (cost in the U.S. is equivalent to five or so Bialetti moka pots); does it offer any advantages, or what defines this pot’s value?

I personally bought the pot partly out of curiosity, spurred on by the demise of my Bialetti pot. Distracted, I had put it on the stove without water. My first clue to this blunder was when the handle fell off (clunk) on the stove. Inside, the rubber ring was fused to the top. That can’t happen to the 9090. At worst, the ring could be melted off the steel. The handle is metal, so you won’t get a half-melted handle, either (as on my first Bialetti pot). In short, I expect the 9090 to last long enough to recover the expense.

About that rubber ring someone asked about: its purpose is to make a seal. Once you have a seal, compressing the rubber more won’t make a difference if the pressure doesn’t increase. Rubber performs very well in compression. For these reasons, I don’t think the clamp mechanism means replacing the rubber ring more often. (It might be harder to find an Alessi ring though.)

In use, this pot is a dream. The coffee holder stands up, so if you sleepily grind your coffee then need to put the holder down while you fill the base, you can. (At least on the tiny 1-cup model, which I have.) The pot snaps shut, and it makes quiet noises on the stove top; “ssssss” (boiling), a spitting sound while the coffee comes out, and “ssssss” when no more water will come up. A cap on the spout means you can leave the top flipped open without spatter on the stovetop. I dutifully used an inverted spoon on my Bialetti (on advice I found here) but I love not having to.

I plan to wash this pot with soap (unlike my aluminum pot which I just wiped) in order to switch between coffees. There are cheaper stainless steel pots, but I don’t like their looks much.

That brings me to aesthetics: The workmanship on the 9090 is stunning; you can see the turned edges of metal at the top, simply but elegantly done, and the traces of welding, etc. It looks like a machine, and in fact I will end by saying that what it really reminds me of is a musical instrument. Not just because it is nicely made of shiny metal but because what it feels like to use it is like you’re playing a little coffee tune.

]]> By: Kate http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-4198 Kate Thu, 04 Mar 2010 01:46:33 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-4198 I have had my moka pot since at least 1969. It got me through my bachelor's thesis. (I think I bought it at Zabar's.) It still makes lovely coffee. I've changed the gasket several times, but everything else is original. I've had a catastrophe or two (forgetting to put the water in, leaving off the gasket). Each time I've brewed a couple of pots of baking soda (gentle, no residue) and water to clean the bitter burned coffee out. Water alone will not remove it. I've tried. You can't make decent coffee with that disgusting residue in there. After a couple of coffee brews, the coffee is lovely again. For Cafe Bustelo fans, I often use that with good results. I used to commute on the Cross Bronx Expresssway. Does anyone else remember the heavenly aroma from the Cafe Bustelo plant? I have had my moka pot since at least 1969. It got me through my bachelor’s thesis. (I think I bought it at Zabar’s.) It still makes lovely coffee. I’ve changed the gasket several times, but everything else is original. I’ve had a catastrophe or two (forgetting to put the water in, leaving off the gasket). Each time I’ve brewed a couple of pots of baking soda (gentle, no residue) and water to clean the bitter burned coffee out. Water alone will not remove it. I’ve tried. You can’t make decent coffee with that disgusting residue in there. After a couple of coffee brews, the coffee is lovely again.

For Cafe Bustelo fans, I often use that with good results. I used to commute on the Cross Bronx Expresssway. Does anyone else remember the heavenly aroma from the Cafe Bustelo plant?

]]> By: Keith http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-4129 Keith Fri, 26 Feb 2010 22:19:54 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-4129 ...just didn’t have a chance to learn this trick from them. …just didn’t have a chance to learn this trick from them.

]]> By: Keith http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-4128 Keith Fri, 26 Feb 2010 22:18:13 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-4128 Thank you, *Tom (the first)*. I was just in the process of redacting my reply when up popped your response to our “alter” Tom. Here was my comment I was in the process of redacting: “Tom, I fully concur with everything you’ve said up till now but I don’t quite get your point here. I am not a scientist and my Moka pot is not “polished and shiny inside the base” but every Italian I know (yes, I repeat, EVERY ITALIAN I KNOW!!) tells me I must NEVER (I repeat, NEVER) let soap touch the pot otherwise the taste will be seriously impaired. Why this is so I don’t know (Sorry!! I do have various scientific theories, but not being a scientist myself their value is probably zilch!!). Be that as it may, I have never particularly wished to sacrifice one of my precious Moka pots for the sake of a useless experiment to prove that they were (surprise! surprise!) right all along!!! Anyway, apparently you agree with them (see your posts of 30 Aug, 17 Nov x 2, Jan 22, Mar 10, Jun 9 & Jun 10).” Btw I very much agree with Dina about air-drying the rubber seal. This is one thing I didn’t pick up from my Italian friends. But I have learnt from experience that if I hang up my gasket to dry, it dries properly leading to a more hermetic seal and so creates a greater pressure within the pot leading to a better brew. I should hastily add that I expect our Italian friends already know this and I Thank you, *Tom (the first)*. I was just in the process of redacting my reply when up popped your response to our “alter” Tom. Here was my comment I was in the process of redacting:

“Tom, I fully concur with everything you’ve said up till now but I don’t quite get your point here. I am not a scientist and my Moka pot is not “polished and shiny inside the base” but every Italian I know (yes, I repeat, EVERY ITALIAN I KNOW!!) tells me I must NEVER (I repeat, NEVER) let soap touch the pot otherwise the taste will be seriously impaired. Why this is so I don’t know (Sorry!! I do have various scientific theories, but not being a scientist myself their value is probably zilch!!). Be that as it may, I have never particularly wished to sacrifice one of my precious Moka pots for the sake of a useless experiment to prove that they were (surprise! surprise!) right all along!!! Anyway, apparently you agree with them (see your posts of 30 Aug, 17 Nov x 2, Jan 22, Mar 10, Jun 9 & Jun 10).”

Btw I very much agree with Dina about air-drying the rubber seal. This is one thing I didn’t pick up from my Italian friends. But I have learnt from experience that if I hang up my gasket to dry, it dries properly leading to a more hermetic seal and so creates a greater pressure within the pot leading to a better brew. I should hastily add that I expect our Italian friends already know this and I

]]> By: Tom (the first) http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-4127 Tom (the first) Fri, 26 Feb 2010 19:52:27 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-4127 First, I would like to distance myself from "Tom"'s comments on Feb 26. He's a different Tom. Its not me. Second, I will answer his question: it is not shiny, it is dull. Third, I will ask "Tom" to knock off the Alton Brown imitation. This isn't a science class. The entire Italian Republic does not use soap. Basta. First, I would like to distance myself from “Tom”’s comments on Feb 26. He’s a different Tom. Its not me.

Second, I will answer his question: it is not shiny, it is dull.

Third, I will ask “Tom” to knock off the Alton Brown imitation. This isn’t a science class. The entire Italian Republic does not use soap. Basta.

]]> By: Tom http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-4122 Tom Fri, 26 Feb 2010 12:26:51 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-4122 None of the people sternly warning not to use soap or vinegar actually has any empirical basis for this advice. Can we have less evangelism and more hard science please? I don't soap my pot in any case, but it often produces something best described as mine run-off. I suspect the highly porous unpolished aluminium walls of the base are leaching acrid compounds into the water. My question is, are your people's pots polished and shiny inside the base, where you fill it with water? None of the people sternly warning not to use soap or vinegar actually has any empirical basis for this advice. Can we have less evangelism and more hard science please?

I don’t soap my pot in any case, but it often produces something best described as mine run-off. I suspect the highly porous unpolished aluminium walls of the base are leaching acrid compounds into the water.

My question is, are your people’s pots polished and shiny inside the base, where you fill it with water?

]]> By: Dina Crusiamato http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-3975 Dina Crusiamato Thu, 28 Jan 2010 11:15:43 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-3975 Tom is correct, never use soap in a Moka. It is vital to change the rubber ring when you are getting poor results. Always let it air dry after each use. Upside down on a towel is best. I use a scrub brush to scrub out the inside of the base if hard water spots appear. Mine is from Italy. Tom is correct, never use soap in a Moka. It is vital to change the rubber ring when you are getting poor results. Always let it air dry after each use. Upside down on a towel is best. I use a scrub brush to scrub out the inside of the base if hard water spots appear. Mine is from Italy.

]]> By: Keith http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-3863 Keith Fri, 01 Jan 2010 21:22:25 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-3863 General advice regarding cleaning. Ignore almost all the advice you find on the internet. Just follow the advice you get from all Italians. Which is: no vinegar, no nothing, JUST W A T E R. General advice regarding cleaning. Ignore almost all the advice you find on the internet. Just follow the advice you get from all Italians. Which is: no vinegar, no nothing, JUST W A T E R.

]]> By: Keith http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-3862 Keith Fri, 01 Jan 2010 20:47:04 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-3862 Sounds like you need to change the gasket. Don't know where you can buy one in the UK, but this is where I get mine from over here on the continent: http://www.natarianni.fr/321-pieces-detachees-cafetiere-aluminium . And they take international orders as well. By the way, when you cleaned the gasket, did you clean the filter plate as well (the round metal bit that the gasket holds in place)? If the holes are bunged up, you can use a sewing needle to unblock them. Not ideal, but it does work. And you can use your bare fingernails to get the accumulated coffee and calc off. But then again, when you order a set of three gaskets, you get a new filter plate thrown in as well. Imho vinegar, as with ALL cleaning agents, is a definite no-no. Hope this helps. Sounds like you need to change the gasket. Don’t know where you can buy one in the UK, but this is where I get mine from over here on the continent: http://www.natarianni.fr/321-pieces-detachees-cafetiere-aluminium . And they take international orders as well. By the way, when you cleaned the gasket, did you clean the filter plate as well (the round metal bit that the gasket holds in place)? If the holes are bunged up, you can use a sewing needle to unblock them. Not ideal, but it does work. And you can use your bare fingernails to get the accumulated coffee and calc off. But then again, when you order a set of three gaskets, you get a new filter plate thrown in as well.

Imho vinegar, as with ALL cleaning agents, is a definite no-no.

Hope this helps.

]]> By: Mike http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html/comment-page-2#comment-3859 Mike Fri, 01 Jan 2010 15:43:47 +0000 http://www.talkaboutcoffee.com/how-to-make-coffee-with-a-stovetop-moka-pot.html#comment-3859 I think my girlfriends filter is blocked. First sympton was that it leaking from the side. So I cleaned the rubber gasket. Now, it produce copious amounts of steam through the pressure release valve on the side, and a very small amount of coffee makes it into the upper chamber. Its a two cup steel Billati. Whats the best way to clean it. Its probably an accumulation of coffee and calc. I was thinking of vinegar. Any suggestions? I think my girlfriends filter is blocked. First sympton was that it leaking from the side. So I cleaned the rubber gasket. Now, it produce copious amounts of steam through the pressure release valve on the side, and a very small amount of coffee makes it into the upper chamber. Its a two cup steel Billati. Whats the best way to clean it. Its probably an accumulation of coffee and calc. I was thinking of vinegar. Any suggestions?

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